Curse

lord_shar · Dec 01, 2005, 01:45 AM // 01:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

yes lbs i have been wronged by a runner who represented him self as some graduate of a academy this happened already almost a week ago

i am no longer sure of his name only that he claimed to be a graduate or something or other at the time
at a later point in time i saw a duo runers doing the same mission and made inquries about their academy since i doubt there are that many around they told me the runner was not qualified most likly a student and that you guys are based out of gwg. perhaps it was thier fault for directing me here as i now see you have your own forum and arent really part of gwg (which is why i was asking if the mods supported your school saying they belong here)

this is the point in which i began to post here (with bad spelling and grammar)

almost immediatly i was accused of flaiming and making false accusations

im sorry i cant provide the burden of proof but as one honest gammer to another, you guys handled yourselves extremly poorly not everyone is out to get you but honest mistakes will happen somewhere in the insanity of your members attacking me and others left and right i was coralled into being typed as a lbs hater, i have expressed i am not for or against you i only want to know how this happend and whether you will claim responsiblity for it (for which i would only have sought an apology and nothing further any curtosys you would have extened to me at that point would be yours to make, i only implied you should be more polite rather that the members of lbs who also reprrsent you should be more polite)

this is the point where i became biast about your operation and made questions about your whole set up

one bad apple spoils the bunch as they say
at this point i neither care to debate your school your runners or your motivations for lbs, i only sought to find out more about this lbs situation as it seemed i should perhaps report the runner at this time but sadly that window has closed

ther only reason i remain here is becuase it seems there is no other place to voice myself as your personal forum only serves as a request center and at least here there is somewhat of a neutral party present

There's another place to report getting scammed/defrauded: http://support.guildwars.com. You will need screen shots, the location of the exchange, the time, and the name of the party who defrauded you of gold and/or items.

The guild tag is also meaningless, since anyone can choose an "LBS", "lbs" LBs" or any number of combinations forming a pseudo guild identity, which is why the player's individual name is so critical.

I don't have any doubts that LBS would refund any gold defrauded of a customer AND expel the guilty party from LBSRA if they were actual members. However, a player name is needed, or else all the claims and accusations won't bring back the stolen gold.

An organization can't be fairly judge based on one bad member by today's industry and legal standards. Yes, the brand name will be hurt, but the law recognizes the difference between an organization plagued with corruption vs. the deeds of one individual.

gslavik · Dec 01, 2005, 01:45 AM // 01:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Steel

I think you are pretty close on the average player's age. Try doubling that and you will be a lot closer to the average age of the LBS membership. I'm just suggesting that the people who join the Academy regularly don't need your protection from making their own decisions on where to find new challenges in the game. That's all.

Well, what I would like to do is to record everyone's age, add them all up and the divide by the number of people there are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Steel

Crime statistics suggest otherwise: that lower education levels are correlated with victimization.

Statics say what happens in general. Don't forget your outliars, because in what I said, every outlier is fair game. This is what happens when you don't learn how statics are made. Statistical answers are made based on very conrete formulas in which there is a variable which is picked arbitrarily. If the data is close enough to both answers, the value of this variable determines the actual statistical answer. I have tried to do this and while in some cases it is not easy, in cases when data is close enough to ANY answer, it can be done. Idea is to take a pound of salt with statics.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Steel

It is a reasonable question and one that I appreciate you qualifying as hypothetical, because it is essentially unthinkable that an LBS member would scam someone. But entertaining the question: If such a thing were to happen and if you could make a showing with screenshots, admissions, or any other competent evidence, I would personally restore the lost money from my own vault, and that person would no longer be a member of the Academy. Their reputation would be destroyed. It is as simple as that.

How is their reputation ruined? If it is a graduate who has the Forgerunner bow, how do you take it away?
The difference between a rule and a law is that a rule describes an action which is allowed/disallowed while a law describes the consequence for an action.
You have stated is a rule, not a law.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Steel

Huh? They might be busy with real life, they might be retired, they might be playing the game, they might be in the Hall of Heroes, they might be somewhere more profitable for themselves, they might be running repeat customers who are contacting them directly or through our forums (www.LBSRA.net), and they may be doing any of a million other things. I have never found in game advertising to be particularly effective, and there are much more profitable places to be than Beacon's Perch. Is it somehow significant in your mind that you haven't seen LBS runners advertising in two specific locations recently?

See? You should've taken my advice and used that one sentence response. It is important in that if your students do not advertise (I am not even bothering with graduates) that means that they cannot skillfully complete the task. If they cannot skillfully complete the task then they do not know enough or have not been taught enough to be able to complete the task skillfully. If they have not been taught enough or told enough about the task then their teacher(s) (read: YOU and anyone else who is supposed to teach) have not told them enough or have not taught them enough. If you have not taught them enough or told them enough, you are violating your own contract in which you claim to teach these people to complete the task skillfully for 15 Globs of Ectoplasms.

Simple first order prepositional logic. In New York State, this is taught in grade 9.

EDIT:
As for killer toast. I did not ask it. LBS asked me to guess the average age and I guessed a range of 12 to 15 years old. Thank you for replying though. I still think that what LBS has taught you is not worth 15 Globs of Ectoplasm. You should've saved up 15 Obsidian Shards and the crafting materials needed to make a Fissure of Woe helmet for your warrior. If you did that then I think that you would be looked at with more repect than you are looked at now, especially if I was looking at you.

EDIT2:
lord_shar, thank you for that piece of information. However, even if it is one person then it could also show a beginning trade. As in, one runner scams, then another, then another and so on and so forth. The idea should be to never have that trend even in the beginning stages.

Blue Steel · Dec 01, 2005, 01:47 AM // 01:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

yes lbs i have been wronged by a runner who represented him self as some graduate of a academy this happened already almost a week ago

Can you tell me exactly what happened? When you say "wronged you" what do you mean? Did they keep money from you and not complete a run? Or what exactly? Hurt your feelings with something they said? Gave you an incorrect impression about their qualifications? I do need specifics if you want me to do anything about it.

gslavik · Dec 01, 2005, 01:59 AM // 01:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Steel

You might want to go back to 9th grade, gslavik, because that premise quoted above does not work on its face, and it is about as nonsensical as anything I have ever read. ...

You are entitled to your opinion. The better answer would be that they are so backed up in private messages for a run that they do not need to advertise. Yet again, you chose to discredit me rather than exploit a rather obvious loophole in my flow of logic. Using the hole is much simpler. How does my premise does not "work on its face"? If you want to say that it is a false assumption, then tell me why.

EDIT:
killer toast, for the same reason why there is a very large price difference between a crafter's sword that has 9 requirement in Swordsmanship versus a Crystalline sword that has 8 requirement in Swordsmanship with both having an added 15% damage bonus when your health is over 50% of your max. "It looks cool," (reffering to the crystalline sword) that is what someone told me when I asked them about the price difference. I am very happy with my crafter's sword with included Sundering 9% chance and Swordsmanship +1 (chance: 20%) upgrades.

EDIT2:
masterbeef, how is it an accomplishment for society? Do you also want to say that if he didn't pay the 15 Globs of Ectoplasm fee to learn something that he would not have made that much money? If so, then obviously killer toast needs the game working shown to him as he cannot see them himself (hence the need to pay someone to have them shown to him).

eol · Dec 01, 2005, 02:06 AM // 02:06

there is no reason any more to delve into investigation i attempted to do so myself and am unable to particularly identify the indivdual hes 3 meters in height wearing a suit of armour and is caucasion, he particularly made a poor attempt at concluding a mission at which point i recieved a error 7 (after he had died) could not remember his name well other then his gimick which i recognized later on and was never contacted by him/her again im not sadened by the lose of my gold i jsut wanted to try and track him down after stumbling across a batch of more students graduates what ever ( i still think its ambigous but i needed to know how im after), thus my inability to screen shot you your god damn evidence

what hurt my feelings is your members attacking me on this very thread for making inquires about this person this school and this whole outfit ( im sure you can understand me being paranoid and suspicous of your intentions) so far the only people who attempted to be helpful is elita and yourself i cant say the same for others, it doesnt matter to me anymore

hopefully in the future you will delegate some more restraint to your representatives with how the speak to ppl who make valid accusations whether you wish to acknowlege them or not (perhaps its not up to me to find him but yourself) all i would have really wanted at most is some reassurance you will be more diligant with the activites of your organization

masterbeef · Dec 01, 2005, 02:10 AM // 02:10

It's an accomplishment for toast because he's borderline retarded, its an accomplishment for society because it sounded funny saying accomplishment for society. And yes, he may have made that amount of money but it does show what a "semi"-retarded/committed member in LBSRA can achieve through a rather short period of time.

gslavik · Dec 01, 2005, 02:15 AM // 02:15

masterbeef, I hope that you aren't implying that LBS would accept a "borderline retard" as one of her students. If he's not the only "borderline retard" who has been accepted, then the quality of service (from my perspective) "goes out the window" (figuratively).

Loviatar, what is "KAISER MEDICAL"?
If it's a medical institution (hospital/clinic/etc.) then maybe they have enough customers to take care of without advertising. I told LBS to provide a similar response to make everyone's life simpler.

Loviatar · Dec 01, 2005, 02:39 AM // 02:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by gslavik

To relate this to LBS. I am from New York City and if I move to California, how can I be sure that they really have very good doctors/nurses? Is there some sort of public registry of feedback from their customers which is not under any control of Kaiser Medical?

several but i cant remenber them.

possibly the better business bureau
might look for the California equivalent of the oversight groups you have there.

they do exist, trust me (joe isuzu)

gslavik · Dec 01, 2005, 02:48 AM // 02:48

Unfortunatelly, we do not have the same facilities to check whether or not LBS is an "authority" on running from Beacon's Perch to Droknar's Forge.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loviatar

several but i cant remenber them.

possibly the better business bureau
might look for the California equivalent of the oversight groups you have there.

they do exist, trust me (joe isuzu)

Mindcrime · Dec 01, 2005, 03:33 AM // 03:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

that sounds nothing like the events i have described to you and yes it was before monk boss that he asked for payment but the story in which you are telling has nothing to do with me

now this maybe the case with some other runner but not with the runner i was dealing with (aparently from my inquiries he was a non graduate)

how your scenario has anything to do with my situation i do not understand and do not see how it is relevant unless you are telling me that this is the statment your are posting on behalf of the runner in question i dont even remember his name anymore could you at least tell me which runner described to you this scenario?

if you are for example posting to me what the typical scenario is then what is the point of it?

my problem was what do you guys do when u have a bad runner, your telling me you want a screen shot or to stfu

at the least you could have done is apologize for the blunder and offer another runner but instead i am constantly meeting with your hostilities

The reason why I posted the true scenario in the first place, was because you started your first ever replay on guru with an unconfirmed source of accusing LBS runner for scam, even though you claimed; you didn't know if it was true. Yes, you had nothing to do with that scenario. I just wanted to clear that replay-post with a true answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

why is this allowed to be posted on gwg forums if this is clearly not something that is meant to be offered for help but for profit i can understand a trade section but this school really doesnt feel like it belongs here wonder why the mods allow it is my question

seriously though about your dye farming school if lbs can get away with this why not start a similar school for other things seems like a good way to scam.. err i mean earn ecto

i can teach ppl how to make max perfect items for 60k or less by visiting collectors of course i will not disclose the location of these dessert collectors ..ooops but anyway if you pay me 14 ecto i can link you to a site with research on the locations of these collectors and what they require that i have not made myself for 14 ecto learn how to geat perfect weapons cheap from teh dessert ..oops gotta stop saying dessert

This is your SECOND replay on this thread. And yet no LBS members have answered to your first post.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

what hurt my feelings is your members attacking me on this very thread for making inquires about this person this school and this whole outfit ( im sure you can understand me being paranoid and suspicous of your intentions) so far the only people who attempted to be helpful is elita and yourself i cant say the same for others, it doesnt matter to me anymore

Read your second replay again and give me a fair answer; Didn't YOU break the ice with that harsh statement about us? Did you think that we would swallow that statement and don't defend ourselves with same words?

90% of the gw population is familiar with that icon/picture above. Including you - expect the same treatment
when you choose your words.

EDIT: As you see I'm losing temper when I see people feeling sad about themselves, when
they for a fact started the discussion from the very beginning with harsh words.

Matauro · Dec 01, 2005, 03:55 AM // 03:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

there is no reason any more to delve into investigation i attempted to do so myself and am unable to particularly identify the indivdual hes 3 meters in height wearing a suit of armour and is caucasion

I think the LBS association would know if there was a 9 foot + runner enrolled/graduated from the academy.

Did this runner happen to go by the name Goliath?

Sorry, i just couldn't resist

eol · Dec 01, 2005, 04:31 AM // 04:31

mindcrime: to your first question it was me who was the client all along wow i know big shocker, how would u feel if you were suspcious of another group would u open up by saying im going to report you all. do you think you would ever learn anything from these individuals

its your own fault for any posts i made after that, you viewed it in a way as to say:

"this person clearly doesnt know what hes talking about, just another troll lets respond with him as we do the others"

well i too can say you dont know what your talking about. to me alot of your school still doesnt make sense and until i had a long conversation in this thread with the more reasonble members of lbs did i come to see the extent you go through to claim yourselves as "qualified" etc

if you want to point fingers and place blame you are just as guility i know what i said perhaps i should post up some of your golden moments

your forgetting im new here and the only reason for my presence was to investigate my situation after having come into contact with your group a second time

if my questions are too hard hitting well then that just means your not prepared for this sort of thing

and belive me you should be happy it was me becuase there could have been another person and im sure he/she wouldnt be as tempermental

Mindcrime · Dec 01, 2005, 05:26 AM // 05:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

mindcrime: to your first question it was me who was the client all along wow i know big shocker, how would u feel if you were suspcious of another group would u open up by saying im going to report you all. do you think you would ever learn anything from these individuals

The client (You?) that refuse to pay? if so.. why did you even post on this thread when the LBS runner didn't do anything wrong. He asked for
the payment before last monk boss and you refuse to pay? Conclusion: LBS runner refuse to complete mission. Was this the purpose you began to questioning us? I'm just noticed the core to this black debate.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

its your own fault for any posts i made after that, you viewed it in a way as to say:

"this person clearly doesnt know what hes talking about, just another troll lets respond with him as we do the others"

well i too can say you dont know what your talking about. to me alot of your school still doesnt make sense and until i had a long conversation in this thread with the more reasonble members of lbs did i come to see the extent you go through to claim yourselves as "qualified" etc

Clearly, if I was outside the academy and had no idea of either LBS and LBSRA. I wouldn't care/wasteing my time about comment my feelings about something that I had no major clue/fact about in a endless circel? It would have been different if your first posts were more in terms of questions instead of chaos with harsh statements without knowing anything?

Quote:

Originally Posted by eol

if you want to point fingers and place blame you are just as guility i know what i said perhaps i should post up some of your golden moments

your forgetting im new here and the only reason for my presence was to investigate my situation after having come into contact with your group a second time

if my questions are too hard hitting well then that just means your not prepared for this sort of thing

and belive me you should be happy it was me becuase there could have been another person and im sure he/she wouldnt be as tempermental

I'm guilty, of course. Why wouldn't I, I'm a member of LBSRA with equal right to comment my opinions, if I feel so. You have the same equal opinion as an outsider - the thing I can't understand is what are your goals with 5 days of debating, how we run our academy/service?

EDIT: My golden moments are very few to begin with. Until last week I have been very neutral on my comments.
I'll rarely use words that are directed to a special someone. Some of the other members comments in another direction. I can't control that, then again I don't blame them either because if you start off like those earlier posts, you should expect;
fight fire with fire

Son of Dusto · Dec 01, 2005, 07:25 AM // 07:25

so lady blue steel, hows your droks run % after the nov 11 update?
if you say 100% ima e-smack you.

The Herbalizer · Dec 01, 2005, 12:37 PM // 12:37

Quote:

Thank you for replying though. I still think that what LBS has taught you is not worth 15 Globs of Ectoplasm. You should've saved up 15 Obsidian Shards and the crafting materials needed to make a Fissure of Woe helmet for your warrior. If you did that then I think that you would be looked at with more repect than you are looked at now, especially if I was looking at you.

Well i payed 15ecto and I think it is a bargain. Yeah I could afford a fissure helm with the tuition cost but now I have like way more and have got so much gold I have no use for it anymore.

Also if someone was running you on a 15k run or whatver why would they scam you for 15k as that is peanuts. They paid 15ecto to join so i dont think they would gamble their reputation and gw running career on a perfetic amount.

gslavik · Dec 01, 2005, 12:44 PM // 12:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hockster

If you had even bothered to read the posts you would see that this exact question was already answered.

Well, I went back through the last two pages and don't see anything that qualifies as an answer, might you be so kind as to quote the answer?

On the other hand, if one of my students scams some one, they shalt be smiten by the almighty god, deprived of the 72 virgins in heaven and sent to hell to work their scams off. It is obvious that my punishment system is far superior to what LBS has come up with.

If you can't the sarcasm, I feel sorry for you.

As for protecting the "dumb," I am highly against it as I believe that we should remove all warning labels and have the problem solve itself.

EDIT:
The Herbalizer, if you have no use for your gold anymore in-game, why don't you give it to me so I can make use of it.

Mindcrime · Dec 01, 2005, 01:06 PM // 13:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by gslavik

Well, I went back through the last two pages and don't see anything that qualifies as an answer, might you be so kind as to quote the answer?

On the other hand, if one of my students scams some one, they shalt be smiten by the almighty god, deprived of the 72 virgins in heaven and sent to hell to work their scams off. It is obvious that my punishment system is far superior to what LBS has come up with.

If you can't the sarcasm, I feel sorry for you.

As for protecting the "dumb," I am highly against it as I believe that we should remove all warning labels and have the problem solve itself.

EDIT:
The Herbalizer, if you have no use for your gold anymore in-game, why don't you give it to me so I can make use of it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blue Steel

It is a reasonable question and one that I appreciate you qualifying as hypothetical, because it is essentially unthinkable that an LBS member would scam someone. But entertaining the question: If such a thing were to happen and if you could make a showing with screenshots, admissions, or any other competent evidence, I would personally restore the lost money from my own vault, and that person would no longer be a member of the Academy. Their reputation would be destroyed. It is as simple as that.

"deprived of the 72 virgins in heaven and sent to hell to work their scams off" Nice punishment btw.

EDIT: I can't find anything more damaging by your own reputation, if the honest academy kicks
you out or don't want to be associated with.

gslavik · Dec 01, 2005, 01:19 PM // 13:19

Mindcrime, I am sorry, but I see that answer to be something a United States politician would say. The kicking part is clear, but anything beyond that is under question.

Their reputation will be destroyed? How would it be destroyed? Just because they are not in LBS, their reputation is destroyed? Even as you say, you do not have to be a memeber of the guild to be it's graduate. It is simple as that.

This is where LBS relies on some mystical power for the person's reputation to be destroyed, which I think is inadequate. My punishment relies on the almighty god!!! God does not fail!!! Praise the lord and thank you Jesus!!!

Can I get an amen?

Edit: I also think that evolution is a bunch of hooey and we are actually descendants of giant clams. </sarcasm> That's what scientology says.

Takeko Nakano · Dec 01, 2005, 01:30 PM // 13:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by gslavik

To relate this to LBS. I am from New York City and if I move to California, how can I be sure that they really have very good doctors/nurses? Is there some sort of public registry of feedback from their customers which is not under any control of Kaiser Medical?

The problem with LBSA is that there is no external moderation. All institutions need impartial, independent individuals to check that tutors et al aren't being too generous. In short - LBSA is self-regulating, so there's no way to be sure of the standards of the "graduates".

What we really need is a regulatory authority, though unfortunately there's no one to fund it

gslavik · Dec 01, 2005, 01:32 PM // 13:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeko Nakano

The problem with LBSA is that there is no external moderation. All institutions need impartial, independent individuals to check that tutors et al aren't being too generous. In short - LBSA is self-regulating, so there's no way to be sure of the standards of the "graduates".

What we really need is a regulatory authority, though unfortunately there's no one to fund it

Thank for stating my point properly. It is exactly what I wanted to say.

<sarcasm>I choose god to be the impartial regulator. Because if they are being "too generous" he can deprive them of the 72 virgins in heaven and send them off to hell!!! </sarcasm>

EDIT:
Mindcrime, did you pay the tuition fee also? That could be the reason for defending LBS. You have to rpotect your investment, like all the other members.

EDIT2:
Don't forget to use Holy Veil in the run. It helps.